How Stanford Supports Alumni Career Development with the PlusFive Program

James Tarbox:

I think it’s so vital to the functioning of a career center on campus to be connected to their Alumni Association. If they don’t have that connection, I think that they disadvantage themselves to do things like a PlusFive program, and just as importantly to engage alumni at things like career fairs and networking events and panels that you offer. And I think what we do really well in terms of the work that I am experiencing with Theanne and the Stanford Alumni Association is we inform each other, let each other know what’s coming up, what are some opportunities, where can we co-present, where can we co-operate in terms of offering programs.

It’s just such a learning experience. And again, because careers reach into the student experience and out to the alumni experience, that second piece needs to be there. I can’t say enough about if you want to initiate some sort of a program, you’ve got to have those partners, and those partners live in the Alumni Association.

Meredith Metsker:

Hey everyone. Welcome back to the Career Everywhere podcast. I’m your host Meredith Metsker, and today I am joined by James Tarbox and Theanne Thomson, both of Stanford University. James is the assistant vice provost and executive director of Stanford Career Education, and Theanne is the director of Alumni Career Connections and interim director of Student Programs. Thank you both for being here.

James Tarbox:

Thank you.

Theanne Thomson:

Thank you Meredith.

Meredith Metsker:

Yeah, I am super glad to have you both, and I’m excited to talk to you today about the Stanford PlusFive program and how your respective teams in career education and the Alumni Association work together to support alumni with their career development for up to five years after graduation. So alumni career support, as we all know, is definitely top of mind for a lot of career leaders right now, but sometimes it’s hard to know where to start or what resources, what you might need, what kind of time you need. So I am looking forward to digging into how you all do this there at Stanford and what you’ve learned. Before I get into my questions though, is there anything else either of you would like to add about yourselves, your backgrounds, or your roles there at Stanford?

James Tarbox:

I have one thing to add. I’ve been watching your podcast. It’s so fun, by the way, to see how people have responded to this question. And I want to go on record as saying I used my career center starting in my sophomore year, and I’m going to date myself when I say this. I met with a career counselor and she said to me, “Oh, just read this book,” which was called What Color Is Your Parachute? “And do the exercises.” And there was this one exercise we had to create a flower and it was all about your life. I created that flower on these big pieces of paper. I brought it back to the career center and when she walked out to meet me, I said, “So I finished.” And she said, “I’ve never had anyone do that.”

Meredith Metsker:

Finish the book?

James Tarbox:

And she looked very shocked and I remember thinking to myself, “Oh, I wonder what’s going to come next?” And after the Shock kind of went away, we actually looked at, because I was interested in becoming a lawyer, 10 alumni that I could interview with to do info interviews, but I’ll never forget the look on her face when I showed up and I had all of that stuff done and she was just like, “I’m not sure where we go next.”

Meredith Metsker:

Oh, that’s funny. It’s called What Color Is Your Parachute?

James Tarbox:

What Color is Your Parachute?

Meredith Metsker:

Okay, I’ll have to check that out.

Theanne Thomson:

I read the same book, James. It must’ve been one of the popular books at the time. That’s great. And Meredith, I’ll just add quickly, I am an alum of Stanford, and when I think back about my career, I think every position I’ve gotten has been through a Stanford referral. So really excited just to talk with you about the power of the alumni network today.

Meredith Metsker:

Yeah, I love that. I have relied on alumni referrals from my alma mater, the University of Idaho. It was actually how I made my transition from the journalism industry into marketing. I reached out to a fellow Idaho Vandal who had made a similar transition and I was like, “Hey, from one Vandal to another, I would like to move into marketing. What advice do you have?” And she ended up getting me a job.

Theanne Thomson:

That’s fantastic.

Meredith Metsker:

So, yeah, I think we know those alumni career connections work for sure. All right, so before I get into my more specific questions about our topic today, I do want to kick us off with a question I ask all of our guests here on the podcast, and that’s, what does Career Everywhere mean to you?

Theanne Thomson:

When I think of Career Everywhere, Meredith, I think about the fact that career connections are made everywhere in the Everyday Encounters. What I’ll say to students is, while you’re a student for four years at your university at Stanford, you’re an alum for life, and there are 245,000 alumni all over the world who are actively making connections daily. Those could be social connections, they don’t necessarily need to be career, but they could evolve into a career contact later. So really it’s just that message of you’re connected to this great alumni community for life. And that’s really how I think about Career Everywhere, is that it’s in the everyday conversations.

Meredith Metsker:

I love that. James, how about you?

James Tarbox:

So I’m going to build a little bit on what Theanne said. And I view Career Everywhere is an opportunity to reframe. And what I mean by that is it goes from being one place on campus to every space where student learning occurs. And I think that’s so important because regardless of if it’s a classroom or if it’s a space where student orgs are meeting, they’re all thinking about their futures and career is all about future. So I love the concept of Career Everywhere.

Meredith Metsker:

Yeah, well said, both of you. I think I totally agree. Obviously. It’s about getting career beyond the walls of the career center and really engaging the entire ecosystem, which I think is a nice segue into our topic today, which is again how you all support alumni career development through the Stanford PlusFive program. So to get us started, can you just walk me through what the PlusFive program is and what it entails?

James Tarbox:

Sure. I’ll start off with the career piece. So Stanford Career Education works in collaboration with Stanford Alumni Association. And what Stanford Career Education provides is the opportunity for recent alumni to meet for career coaching appointments. There’s no limits on the number of appointments they can have, they explore a variety of topics that occur as we come out of college and transition into career, and look at issues that we really didn’t think about when we were an undergraduate or pursuing a degree that come up in the workplace when we start to understand that, “This career I’ve chosen to pursue is now my life, and I need support to figure it out.” So career coaching is the part that we contribute.

Theanne Thomson:

Great. And thank you James. And this is really an incredible partnership. If you think about James’s team does the career education, all that incredible work of thinking through “Where am I, what’s my next step?” And then really the Alumni Association partners with Career on the Connection piece. And so we offer career pathways, panel, networking events, we have regional events, we have resources like our alumni directory and Stanford alumni groups. So a combination of just offering events that augment the career education with that alumni perspective, offering events where recent graduates can meet and network with alums, those could be social or career-focused, and then resources where they can just continue to explore how to make those connections individually through the directory or at other events with Stanford alumni groups.

Meredith Metsker:

And this is all up to five years, correct?

James Tarbox:

Yes, up to five years. By the way, just for note, we would never refuse anyone’s service. So people can contact [inaudible 00:07:33].

Theanne Thomson:

And Meredith, what I will say is the connection resources are available to any alum for the rest of their life. So while our focus in this program, like the career pathways panels and the networking events have been tailored to PlusFive, the connection events are open to all alumni.

Meredith Metsker:

Okay, so I’m curious, how do you go about advertising these services to alumni who are out and about and trying to get their careers off the ground and busy? I’m just curious how you get their attention.

Theanne Thomson:

Absolutely. So SAA has a careers newsletter and we have a recent graduate version that focuses on resources for that PlusFive population, and that’s where we advertise the PlusFive career coaching. And then we also have a Stanford Where You Live newsletter, which is a regionally based newsletter that lists all of our events like an event digest. And so we will cross-reference any of the events that are career-related in that newsletter. And that way recent grads, they might see the careers newsletter, or if they’re more socially oriented, they may just be looking at that regional newsletter with all those social events, and we have a career section that’s part of it that promotes those opportunities.

Meredith Metsker:

Okay, very cool. I’m curious, you were talking about some of the unique needs that recent grads and alumni have when it comes to career coaching. What are some of the common topics or questions or issues that you all are getting and helping to address?

James Tarbox:

Yeah, so what happens during that career transition is I think people often ask the question of, “Did I make the right choice? And then how do I manage this thing called a career?” And so as we are advancing our work with PlusFive, we’re actually right now the person who serves as the lead career coach for this effort, is working with all the other career coaches in our department to say, “What are the topics that are coming up that are challenging for you, and how might we work together to make sure that we resolve those?”.

I just want to pause and mention that two years ago under a different lead career coach, we did a summer reading called the Defining Decade. And what we looked at was what happens to people in those 10 years between 20 and 30, and how might that inform the work that we’re doing with recent alumni to really show them we understand where you are, we’ve got a grasp of the challenges, and we’re here to support you? So that’s the way that we… the topics, how we unearth the topics and how we think about supporting them from the career coaching perspective.

Meredith Metsker:

Okay. Yeah, I imagine, that’s… I mean even just thinking back to my own experience, that’s an interesting time, 20 to 30, trying to figure out what you want to do with your life, with your career. Like you said, James, figuring out if I made the right choice. Yep, it’s intimidating for sure. So I would love to hear more about kind of the why here. Why did you start the PlusFive program and what were some of those early signals to you that this was needed?

James Tarbox:

Well, can I give a little bit of context? I think this is really kind of cool. So Theanne was one of the co-chairs for the committee that hired me. We didn’t know each other before the experience, but I was so thrilled when I learned that the co-chair was from Stanford Alumni Association because in my previous roles I’d always made it a priority to get to meet people and I kept thinking to myself, I need to meet somebody from the Alumni Association.

So as Theanne shows up. As we were looking at doing this and I was talking to the career ed team, and Theanne can easily speak to what she was doing on her side, I talked about this earlier, but I said to the team, I think we need to show people as they graduate that we see them, that we understand their challenges, and that we’re here to support them. And I think PlusFive, because that’s such a defining time in people’s lives is really going to answer that challenge. And Theanne was part of the group that lifted it up in terms of the work that we did when we first launched it. But Theanne, I don’t know if you want to add anything to that or not.

Theanne Thomson:

And thank you James. At the same time we were interviewing James and we’re so lucky to have him here at Stanford, the Alumni Association was actually doing a strategy looking at how might we provide better career support. And we found a couple things, which is a couple of our Ivy Plus peers were providing support up to five years out. We were also getting inquiries at the Alumni Association from recent grads who were really looking at that 18 month to 24 month pivot. Right? Like, I’m out in the world, and as James said, “Oops, is this really what I want to do?” And that was sort of a natural inflection point. And so really it was through our joint partnership that we said, “Why not pilot this?” Which we did in 2021. We ran a six-month pilot, just to learn, will recent grads respond to this, what will resonate with them? And after that six-month pilot, it was a resounding yes, and we continued to build the program.

Meredith Metsker:

Wow, that’s great that you had such a good, positive reaction to that pilot program. And I was even just thinking, again, referencing my own experience, I made my pivot from journalism to marketing less than a year after graduation. So it was pretty clear to me that a change was needed. So I should have gone back to my career center at U of I.

James Tarbox:

You could have done, What Color is Your Parachute?

Meredith Metsker:

Yes, I should have done that. I don’t know the color of my parachute. Okay. So earlier you both kind of mentioned what’s included in the PlusFive program, but I would love to hear more about how you facilitate it, and more specifically, how do the career education and alumni teams collaborate on PlusFive?

James Tarbox:

Yeah, so I’ll do it from logistics perspective. We as a team, so it’s Theanne and the person who reports to her that works on their efforts, and then myself and the lead coach for PlusFive, we all meet together on an ongoing basis. But then the two folks that report to us also meet, I believe on a weekly basis. And then I meet with the lead career coach on a weekly basis. And so there’s lots of interaction going on, and then we work together on an annual report. And so there’s constant interactions, and I think the other thing that happens in Theanne’s area is really great about this with their newsletters, the person who works on contributing content always reaches out to us and says, “Hey, here’s what I’m thinking about including. Do you have anything you want to add?” It’s a really good reality check. Theanne, did you want to add anything?

Theanne Thomson:

Yeah, and thank you, James. I’m so grateful for the collaboration. And early on when we were looking at doing our first winter series of career panels and networking events, and these are virtually held, and that’s a good time to connect PlusFive, sort of that January new year winter timeframe, we said, “Well, what industries are you hearing that young alums might be interested in?” So we would collaborate on what themes and what industries might resonate with recent grads. And so that led to the first set of industry panels and networking events. Since then, in addition to the person I have, we have a full-time person at the Alumni Association who oversees our global industry groups, and there are 28 industry groups that are led by our alumni volunteers. And that’s really how we scale connection is by these alumni led industry groups in sustainability and entrepreneurship, in healthcare, and public service. Because then they organize events with their members and can offer them globally all around the world.

Meredith Metsker:

Okay, so those are networking groups of alumni in a specific industry area and they just meet regularly?

Theanne Thomson:

They do. And in addition to that-

Meredith Metsker:

Cool.

Theanne Thomson:

Yeah, we have regional groups, we have identity based groups. The Alumni Association has over 200 volunteer led alumni groups, and our goal is really to allow alumni to affiliate by the relationship that’s meaningful to them. And so it could be where they live, it could be based on their identity, it could be based on their profession, and what we know is most alumni affiliate in multiple ways and are members of multiple groups and communities.

Meredith Metsker:

That’s so cool. This is also making me think I need to go and check out if Idaho has that. I want to join one. So speaking of this collaboration, I think in our prep call you both mentioned that there’s a 0.5 FTE from both of your teams that focus on this PlusFive program. Is that correct?

James Tarbox:

Yes, for our center it is.

Meredith Metsker:

Okay. I’m curious, so what does that look like? How did you decide on the 0.5 from each department?

James Tarbox:

So pretty good at using just strategy. One of the things that I looked at when I first came in, so I’ve been here four and a half years, was I started to see people changing careers. It was in the midst of the great resignation and I was saying to my supervisor, I think there’s an opportunity here to repurpose one of the FTEs into a 0.5 FTE to support alumni. And just a quick note, student affairs sometimes doesn’t work with alumni, and so it becomes more of a conversation of here’s why it’s important, and that’s the conversation we had. And thankfully my then supervisor was in complete support, but she said, “James, I trust you. Go ahead and run with it,” and the rest is history.

Theanne Thomson:

So at the Alumni Association, we were actually doing a young alumni strategy. And one of the insights we had is that young alums want to make career connections. And so that lent us to hiring a 0.5 FTE that partners now with James, to really think about how do we get the word out about all these amazing connection opportunities, whether it’s through the industry groups or whether it’s through our essay led events. And so that’s how it came to be.

Meredith Metsker:

Okay, yeah, that’s great to hear. I think it’s helpful to kind of hear some of those tactical things you all are doing for the folks who are watching or listening who may want to do something similar. Also on our prep call, James, I think you mentioned that you brought up alumni career support in your interview process.

James Tarbox:

I did.

Meredith Metsker:

I would love to hear that story. I want to make sure our listeners hear that too.

James Tarbox:

Yeah, I’m saying humorously. What I asked in the interview was, “How long did we support alumni as a career center?” And the answer was “A year.” And I said, “Oh, I’m just kind of curious as to why that is, because I think the message we could inadvertently send is that we’re not here to support you when you need us most.” And so the team was really gracious and hearing me out and talking about why I thought we should do it for longer. Putting myself in their positions, I think what they’re seeing and maybe more work, but looking at it strategically from building affiliation with alumni who later become employers is very, very important. And so yeah, it was one of those things where I probably didn’t say it in the most diplomatic of ways, it wasn’t the most polished, however, I think it needed to be heard, and I do think it set the groundwork for people understanding that that was a priority for me coming in as a leader. Does that help in terms of what your recollection was?

Meredith Metsker:

Yeah, yeah, for sure. I also just love that story, because I think it’s a good example. It’s always a risk to bring up a critique in an interview, but I think it helped you, as you said, lay that foundation and set expectations for what your priorities would be, what resources you would need. And clearly it has worked out well for you. And I would love to dig into that concept of supporting alumni with career development just a little bit more. From both of your perspectives, why is it so important to support alumni with career development, especially again in those first five or so years?

Theanne Thomson:

When students come to Stanford, it’s a very defining time and they are discovering who they are, they’re exploring, and there’s a certain amount of trust that comes with being at the institution. And what we heard, and I’ll speak to recent grads and James can elaborate on the student piece, is that when we were getting those inquiries from recent grads, it was just a natural place that they would want to turn. They learned to trust this institution to help them figure out their life phase and they get out into the world, and their inclination was to come back and say, “Well, you helped me as a student. Can you actually help me now as an alum?”

James Tarbox:

Yeah. And I think to add to that, Theanne at a place like Stanford, and please know I’m not saying this in any way that’s dismissive of any other place, but there are so many opportunities and students go through their experiences and quarters, which is very different than the semester. And they’re often so impacted and so engaged with their peers that career comes up maybe in conversations around internships and how many they’ve done, but not in a way where they’re going to dedicate time to coming to the career center. Especially what we find is week six through 10 when we see the traffic slow down.

So I think the idea of being there for them as they make that first year, especially if they don’t have the answer to “What are you doing next? “They might be taking a gap six months or a gap year, and then they come back and they’re expected to have an answer and they’re really not even sure what the question is that they want to answer with regard to career. And so I think that’s where we come in, provide that safe space for them to have those conversations, and to really start to understand what it means to make choices in one’s career and how they develop and move forward on a life path.

Meredith Metsker:

Yeah, that makes a lot of sense. In addition to of course, helping your recent grads and alumni take flight and have successful lives and careers, I have to imagine that having this PlusFive program has probably also been a boon for enrollment work and help in that process, as you’re talking to prospective students and families. Have you found that to be the case?

James Tarbox:

Well, I was going to say, and Theanne I sometimes wonder if Theanne was like, “Why did I ever meet this person?” Whenever I get an opportunity to speak, I always say, “Oh, Theanne, could you join me?” And we speak at Family Weekend, we speak at Admit weekend. Those are two that come top of mind, and I do think that it’s really important for parents to hear, due to the synergies between our two areas, your students are supported as they go through Stanford, and as they transition out from college to career. I think it’s a huge message. Those are my initial thoughts. Theanne, did you have anything you want to add?

Theanne Thomson:

No, James, except for thank you for always including me. I’m always delighted to present with you.

Meredith Metsker:

Yeah, it’s very clear that you two are super aligned both on the PlusFive and it sounds like outside of that too. And I am curious, are there any other ways that you wanted to highlight that your teams do collaborate outside of the PlusFive program?

Theanne Thomson:

Yeah, I’d love to highlight one. There are many, but just one recent example I’ll give is, so as I mentioned, the Alumni Association has been building out these industry groups across every major sector. And the reason we’re doing that is really to create social capital, because many students come into college and they may not have the networks to support them in the area of what they want to pursue. And so now that we’ve built them out across these major sectors, last year we piloted summer networking mixers where we invited our professional groups to organize a summer mixer, we had it on a landing page, there were nine that were held all throughout the world, and we went to career and said, we probably should stand up some resources on this page to help with that, like, “What do I do when I arrive? What questions do I ask? How do I prepare?”

And so our teams worked together to think about, well, what are the resources we need to stand up on the resources page? So you would see the events and at the bottom you had a various resources. And so we just work together to really have a resource page not only for students but also for alumni showing up, and just “Here are some thought starter questions. Here are some ways that you might enter the conversation, think about these things.” And then in addition, we actually used those prompts and engaged our professional groups, and said, “Think about how you can do icebreakers at these sessions,” so that when recent grads or students or alums come in, that you’re facilitating connection and really kind of overcoming that perhaps reluctance somebody might feel that might be more introverted in arriving at the event.

James Tarbox:

I have one. I find that we often involve each other with pilot projects, so there was an alumni weekend that happened this past year and I was so thrilled for us to be a part of it, and sort of the team members who were there with me. It was a Saturday and it was really well attended. And I got a chance to meet a bunch of alumni who actually were more like I would say seven to 12 years out, and had lots of questions. And I said to them what I said earlier, which is “Please,” and I gave them my card and said, “Just contact me. We’ll make sure that we support you.” I got to see how once you advance into that seven, let’s say the 12, 15 year mark, the differences in the career choices you’re making, and just even the conversations I had there. So that’s another example of I would call piloting where Theanne will say, “Hey, we’re having this,” and I’ll be like, “Yeah, kind of [inaudible 00:23:20], we’re going to absolutely be there.”

Meredith Metsker:

Yeah, that’s great. And also Theanne, I love the ideas of including some of those icebreaker or questions or suggestions for networking events. Because I just remember, especially as a younger professional, going to networking events and just being totally unsure how to approach people, if it was appropriate to approach people, if someone was in a conversation do I interject? Do I? So I have vivid memories of standing awkwardly at networking events, so that’s really smart. So now that the PlusFive program is about four years old, correct, it is four years old?

James Tarbox:

Yeah.

Meredith Metsker:

I’m curious what kind of outcomes or results both quantitative and qualitative have you seen so far?

James Tarbox:

So I’ll speak to a little bit of the qualitative in terms of career coaching appointments. We’ve worked every year since the academic year of ’21, ’22 and then ’22, ’23, ’23, ’24, and now we’re doing ’24, ’25. So I just looked at some of the numbers. So when we started with regard to career coaching appointments in the academic year 2021 to 2022, we had 410 appointments. Last or this past academic year from 2023 to 2024, 647, and that’s a 57% jump. A spoiler alert is I think for this current academic year will exceed 800. So you can see that the demand is clearly there. I think the other thing is, I mentioned this earlier, we really do see people where they are and I think that word of mouth or people talking about this is a testament to that, where they see that we’re willing to really pause and listen to them and work with them in terms of career coaching to advance their career. So that’s just kind of a snapshot in terms of career coaching appointment.

Meredith Metsker:

Wow, that’s a very significant jump. I’ll be anxious to hear what the numbers end up being. Anything to add, Theanne?

Theanne Thomson:

Yes, and on the connection side, when we did the pilot, it was a six-month pilot and we had a couple of hundred recent grads engage in our connection events. And then fast-forward to this past academic year where we had over 1,100 recent grads actively making connections through our events. I just have to thank our alumni communities team because that’s our global communities team. They host welcome to events in the fall, and those are extremely popular with recent grads. So that’s an example of it’s a social event, but they’re coming together and making those connections, and we see over 50% of those events, the participants are recent graduates. In the spring they organized industry-based networking meetups, and again, about a third of the participants are recent grads. And then as I mentioned the summer, industry mixers, we have about a third being those recent grads. So what we’re seeing is that it started small. And as recent graduates are becoming aware of these programs and they’re repeating year over year, that it is a space for making connection.

Meredith Metsker:

Yeah, that’s great that you’ve become such a popular resource for your alumni, and that they feel like they can depend on you even after long after they’ve graduated. I’m curious, James, with the career coaching appointments, are those largely virtual, or do you get alumni coming into your office?

James Tarbox:

Excellent question. We use Handshake, and I’m sure many career centers do, so we can parse that out. I would say that in excess of 95% are virtual. And I’m so thrilled that we can offer that with regard to Zoom based meetings and tracking it in Handshake. Because most alumni don’t probably want to come back to campus and try and work through traffic during the ongoing quarter, as it were. And so the fact that yes, the majority are virtual and it really does suit their working needs, so we have the flexibility to meet them if they need to after hours, it works out really well. We definitely have people who come in and use us in person. They usually come over to the career center or we go over to a place called Munger Hall, which is near us, where they can sit outside and chat. But yeah, the majority are virtual.

Meredith Metsker:

Okay. I kind of assumed, but I’m always curious to hear what that breakdown looks like. So looking ahead, what is your vision for the PlusFive program? Are there any plans to extend the support even further beyond five years? I know you mentioned that of course you’re not going to turn anyone away, but I’m just curious what the future vision is.

James Tarbox:

So I’m going to hark back to the flower that I created and how ambitious I was with getting that done. I think the person was surprised because I did it in less than two weeks. And I find that when I work with my supervisors, they often have that same experience where I’ve talked to Theanne about this, and this may have been actually a title you invented, Theanne, not me, was we could have a PlusFive and Five Plus. And I need to get the FTE and the infrastructure to support it, but as I mentioned earlier at that event that I went to, I see a real need for life, by the way, and I’m so thrilled that Stanford Alumni Association offers things for life, but I do see a real need, especially with the way the economy can go, to look at, well, Five Plus, because you never know when something’s going to happen that causes a change in a labor market, and we need people to be able to come in and talk to us about their experience with that and how they work their way through it.

Theanne Thomson:

And James, I’ll add you that on the connection side, again, I mentioned how we do our work is through our alumni volunteers. And while we have our professional communities, I think really talking with them about how to engage the PlusFive population and increasing the events and pathway panels that they offer, so that instead of maybe having three every winter, we have one across every industry every winter, and many of them offer them throughout the year. So I think engaging our current volunteers and continuing to engage other alumni volunteers, because somebody may not be part of a community, but they might be a connector. So as we think about how do I engage that alum, I met with one yesterday who is affiliated with athletics. He is a connector. He’s like, “Look, I like connecting dots, I like connecting people. How can I best serve Stanford in this role?” So it’s thinking about how do we really activate that community of connectors outside of the communities that we already have, to help those recent graduates with their transitions?

Meredith Metsker:

Yeah, that’s really interesting. And it sounds like there’s so many different ways that you’re engaging alumni and really getting them connected, getting them bought in, and just building a ton of affinity with them in terms of helping recent grads, but I imagine that also plays… I’m sure Advancement loves that too.

James Tarbox:

Yes.

Meredith Metsker:

James, I wanted to go back to something you said as well, kind of looking at the PlusFive and then I think you called it Five Plus. So in your mind, what are some of those differences you anticipate in terms of supporting grads up to five years and then maybe those beyond five years in terms of their career development?

James Tarbox:

Yeah, I think the biggest split between the two, is with PlusFive, it’s really trying to understand, “What are the core career decisions that I’m making?” Like, “I thought I wanted to go into management consulting, but look, I’ve been a management consultant and I understand the impact it has on my life.” I’m just using that as an example, it could be any industry. I think what happens with Five Plus is my identity has now been developed around an occupation or an industry. And if I see either that industry going away, an industry shift, I’m just finishing up a book chapter for a career coaching book, and my part is labor market shelters.

When those shift and people lose jobs, it’s a really defining moment because it’s now ingrained in me enough, maybe I’ve been in it a decade, to see that I need to really figure this out with someone and I need to have a safe space to do that because I need to plan next steps, because it’s more than just me, it maybe my spouse, it may be the fact that I have a house. There’s so many things tied up in it. So I think it moves along the trajectory in a different way than I see PlusFive happening.

Meredith Metsker:

Yes, that’s great. I am always interested to hear how career coaches kind of think through those different life changes and phases in addition to the career phases.

Theanne Thomson:

And Meredith, I’ll add, so SAA actually works with alumni career coaches. We have alumni who are career coaches, and so right now, to provide career support to the Five Plus, we engage our alumni career coaches to offer workshops, and we do these quarterly where we’ll have anywhere from probably six to eight workshops in fall, winter, and spring, led by alumni career coaches that are sharing their expertise. And it could range from, how do I get from the interview to the job, how do I hire better, and so they are leveraging their expertise and what they’re hearing from their coaching practices and then bringing that to offer to alumni.

Meredith Metsker:

Okay, that’s really cool. So how does one become a career coach? Do you reach out to them, they reach out to you? I’m just curious how that works.

Theanne Thomson:

Yeah, great question. So they tend to find us, right, because they reach out and say, “Hey, I’d love to offer support to alumni,” so we make sure that they’re certified, right? They’ve been in practice for at least three years. Because what we found is a lot of people can say, “Hey, I want to be a coach,” but we want to make sure that the advice is really grounded in that practice of career coaching. So we have those requirements and then we have a web page that lists the alumni career coaches, and then they offer the workshops for free to alumni.

Meredith Metsker:

Okay, so they go through some training then.

Theanne Thomson:

On their own. They have to come in, they have to show that they’re a certified career coach and that they’ve had a practice for three years that they’ve sustained.

Meredith Metsker:

Okay, that’s really cool. Nice. Cool. Well, is there anything else either of you would like to add about the vision, the future, what you think the program will look like?

James Tarbox:

I think there’s a real need for it, and I’m really looking forward to making that case. And I do that with the understanding that career lives in two worlds. It lives in the student experience world of student affairs, but it also lives in the world of career that are explored and developed outside when people become alumni. And we’re thrilled to have alumni give back, and that we are part of helping them learn how to do that.

Meredith Metsker:

Yeah. It seems really smart to me that you’re all building this foundation now as James mentioned earlier, that the labor market can change at any time, industry change at any time. I’m sure integration of AI is going to change a lot of jobs as we know it. So it seems like it’s great that you have this foundation for supporting alumni now so that they know when things change, they can always go back to Stanford.

James Tarbox:

Absolutely.

Theanne Thomson:

And Meredith, I’ll add to that, that in addition to the groups that I’ve mentioned, we have our Stanford alumni directory, and there’s a section there where alumni can raise their hand and say, “I’m willing to offer career support.” And I’ll just highlight one change we’re making right now just in response to the national environment, is we got a request from the graduate school of business because they have a lot of international students, and they said, “We need to somehow identify alumni who are willing to support international students,” so we’re adding a filter in our directory that is, “I’m willing to help and support international students,” so that whether I’m an international alum or I have an international expertise or I just want to help international students, I can indicate that. So we encourage our alumni to come back to the alumni directory, update their information, show how they want to get involved, and that way we can activate that in supportive programs like PlusFive.

Meredith Metsker:

Yeah, that’s really smart. Allows you to stay agile and kind of respond to current events as they are. So based on what you’ve both learned throughout this process of launching and growing the PlusFive program over the last four years, what advice would you give to other career services leaders or other career leaders in alumni who want to expand support for alumni?

James Tarbox:

I think it’s so vital to the functioning of a career center on campus, to be connected to alumni, their Alumni Associations. If they don’t have that connection, I think that they disadvantage themselves to do things like a PlusFive program, and just as importantly to engage alumni at things like career fairs and networking events, and panels that you offer. And I think that what we do really well in terms of the work that I am experiencing with Theanne and the Stanford Alumni Association, is we inform each other, let each other know what’s coming up, what are some opportunities, where can we co-present, where can we co-operate in terms of offering programs. It’s just such a learning experience. And again, because careers reach into the student experience and out to the alumni experience, that second piece needs to be there. I think I can’t say enough about if you want to initiate some sort of a program, you’ve got to have those partners, and those partners live in the Alumni Association.

Theanne Thomson:

James, I would absolutely, plus one the partnership. I think the strength of our partnership has really helped not just PlusFive, but also students, and I think it’s helped us just have better offerings overall. So, thank you. I think in terms of what advice I would give is I would encourage any Alumni Association or career center to activate the alumni network and to lean into the alumni volunteers, because that’s how you scale, right? Alumni Associations and career centers are thinly resourced. We’ve got 245,000 alumni all over the world. How do we reach those alumni? Well, it’s through our amazing alumni volunteers, and I sort of have become an evangelist. Well, I’ll meet with alumni and I’ll kind of find out, “Well, what are you interested in?” And I was talking with one alum at our Democracy Day event, it was a student event two years ago, and he was a recent grad and I was just sharing what I was doing.

Well, fast-forward a year later, he was like, “Hey, can I start a group in climate tech? ” I’m like, “Of course you can.” And literally within nine months, and he’s a recent graduate, so he’s a case of, he’s a PlusFiver who wants to help others. So he created this amazing community with another recent grad. They’ve had nine events in nine months, both regional mixers, they’ve been at San Francisco Climate Week, they’re going to be at New York Climate Week, they’ve held a career panel on campus, they’ve held a job fair on campus. So just tapping into that alumni energy and allowing them to bring their energy, their drive, their ambition, to help support recent grads and students is a win not only for the alum, but for all the students alumni in Stanford.

Meredith Metsker:

Yeah, and you’re giving them a ton of options for getting involved. They have a whole buffet to choose from. So that’s really cool, that’s a great story. On this note, I’m curious, let’s say we have someone watching or listening and they’re in career services, they want a partner with alumni, but there’s often those walls and those silos, I guess what advice would you give to them about something like a first step they can take to building that partnership to making a compelling case for a partnership? I just would love your perspectives on that.

James Tarbox:

I have an initial one, which is if you have a search going on, and it would make sense to include someone from that area, like they did from my search, to approach them and say, “Hey, what about a search?” And/or probably an even easier one, is you’re getting ready to do a panel and you want to make sure alumni are on it. Reach out to the Alumni Association and say, “Do you have a list of contacts with whom we could work for this sort of panel panel?” I think those are real easy wins and build partnerships, because my guess is if you invite the alumni that they’ve referred, they may show up. They being the folks from the Alumni Association, would want to show up to meet them to make sure that they were welcome to campus. Those are my first two thoughts. Theanne, anything you want to add?

Theanne Thomson:

I love that, James. I think I would add, and I think you mentioned this earlier, which is if you have an opportunity to present to parents or to admits, ask your Alumni Association rep to join you and have them talk about their resources. And I think one of the things that James and I’ve really tried to do is create the bridge from student into alumnihood and really talk about how we create that bridge with intention. And so just a simple act of just inviting or just having them at an association table, let’s say at an event, and we do a lot of joint tabling, James was at our student awards event that we had not too long ago, talking with students about resources and way to give back as a mentor. So I think just really inclusion and thinking about, “Okay, how might I incorporate these campus partners and career education into the work that I do?”

Meredith Metsker:

Okay, yeah, those are both great pieces of advice. And Theanne, I’m glad you mentioned the word intention, because that’s the theme I’m seeing with this conversation with you too is that you approach it with intentionality. It’s not just a partnership that just happened. You have both made it happen, you’ve continued to foster that partnership, and clearly it is working out very well for you and for your students and alumni. So I do want to be mindful of our time here, so I’ll kind of start wrapping this up, but before I do, is there anything else either of you would like to add?

James Tarbox:

I wanted to add, because Theanne started with gratitude for me and I wanted to add gratitude to her. I just wanted to mention that some of the things that she embodies that I’m so thankful for are the commitment. There’s such a commitment to working together. There’s also due diligence. I really love the way that when Theanne and I are meeting, she’ll ask questions and pull in concepts or things that have happened that we can think about. Also that with regard to networking, she’s always there in terms of networking and making sure that people feel seen. And I wanted to reemphasize always shows up. That’s so important. You can’t do this work and do it well if someone is there sometimes. You have to always be there. And Theanne, thank you, you’re always there, I’m so grateful.

Theanne Thomson:

James, thank you. I’m a little overwhelmed at the moment. That was very…

Meredith Metsker:

So sweet.

Theanne Thomson:

… gracious of you. And I want to thank you for being an incredible thought partner. You have an ability to ask questions and really advance whatever topic we have in a strategic way, and bring your depth of expertise in career education to every conversation. And I find that I learn and grow in every conversation with you, and it’s just a delight and pleasure to advance our mutual work together.

Meredith Metsker:

Oh, that was so sweet. You guys are the best. See, this is why the partnership works. Cool. Well, James and Theanne, if people would like to connect with you or learn more from you, where is a good place for them to do that?

James Tarbox:

I prefer email. I mean, I’m on LinkedIn and anybody can reach out to me there, but in case you don’t include my email address, it’s jtarbox5@Stanford. And five is because I’m the fifth child of eight, so that’s why I chose five.

Theanne Thomson:

Okay. And same with me. LinkedIn is fine. You can also find me at Stanford and it’s just my first name, theanne@stanford.edu.

Meredith Metsker:

Okay, perfect. And for those of you who are watching or listening, I’ll be sure to include links to James and Theanne’s LinkedIn profiles and their emails in the show notes so you can reach out to them if you’d like to. All right, so I like to wrap us up with every episode with an answer a question, leave a question thing. So I’ll ask you a question, our last guest left for you, and then you’ll leave a question for the next guest. So our last guest was Danny Pape of Washington University in St. Louis, and he left this question for you. What’s a guilty pleasure TV show that you watch that might surprise people?

James Tarbox:

I would say White Lotus.

Meredith Metsker:

That’s a good one.

James Tarbox:

I didn’t think I would like it after I read things about it, but then I started watching, I thought, “Oh my gosh,” I really find myself wanting to watch it. Yeah.

Theanne Thomson:

I love it. That’s great, James. And for me, I Cannot wait, The Bear Season 4 is dropping soon. I love food and community, and bringing people together, and that show just hits all those points. So I don’t want to run a restaurant though after watching it. It was very clear I don’t want to run a restaurant, but I love the themes of food and community.

Meredith Metsker:

Yes, chef. Yes. I love that. I have not seen the latest season of White Lotus or The Bear, so I’m behind. I think I said when I had this conversation with Danny, I think I said my guilty pleasure TV show was The Walking Dead.

James Tarbox:

Oh.

Meredith Metsker:

That might surprise people. Okay, well, what questions would you like to leave for the next guest? I think I saw that you both have one.

James Tarbox:

Theanne, do you want to start?

Theanne Thomson:

Sure. I think lately I’ve really just been trying to lean into gratitude and joy. So my question is simple, which is, what is a hobby or activity that fills you with joy that you’d like to share with others, or do with other people?

James Tarbox:

Oh, that’s a great-

Meredith Metsker:

Oh, that’s a good one. What would your answer be to that, Theanne?

Theanne Thomson:

Enjoying the outdoors. It would be hiking, rowing, sailing, just any activity. If you want to go outdoors, I’ll be there. Skiing, I’m there.

Meredith Metsker:

Love that.

James Tarbox:

And my-

Meredith Metsker:

Right, James, what’s your question?

James Tarbox:

Because I love writing, I’d ask you if a play word to be written about your life, what would the three word title of that play be, and why?

Meredith Metsker:

Oo. Do you know what yours would be?

James Tarbox:

I do. It’s my purpose in Life, which is Making a Difference, so the title would be Making a Difference. And because it aligns with my purpose, I feel like that’s a fitting title for that play. And I did want to mention, I also thought with the Tonys just having occurred, it could become a Broadway musical. Not mine, but somebody else’s.

Meredith Metsker:

I love that. I’m not sure what my three word title would be. Theanne, do you know yours?

Theanne Thomson:

No, I was thinking about it. I think I’ve been talking about gratitude might be in there somewhere, but I also, James knows something about impact and difference is definitely part of my themes as well. So I have to work on it.

Meredith Metsker:

It could be Gratitude, the Musical. I love that. Those are both great questions and I will be sure to pose those to the next guest. All right, well thank you both for joining me on the podcast today. This is just a fun conversation with lots of great advice and information about how you all are supporting alumni with their career development. So just thank you again for sharing your time and your wisdom today.

James Tarbox:

Thank you,

Theanne Thomson:

Meredith, it’s been a real pleasure. Yeah, thank you so much.